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Post by Eðo Grischun on Dec 9, 2012 16:15:24 GMT -6
Mick, What exactly is the problem with holding offices in other micronations outside of Talossa? In other words, could you please explain this 'conflict of interest' that you see and I don't?
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Post by C. Carlüs Xheraltescù on Dec 9, 2012 16:26:43 GMT -6
I hereby wish to co-sponsor the act. I would add to the reasons why this should be enacted, but I feel would only be repeating what has already been said. Nice work.
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Post by Moritz Fernaodescu on Dec 9, 2012 16:28:28 GMT -6
This is perfect. Excellent!
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Dec 9, 2012 16:56:24 GMT -6
Mick, What exactly is the problem with holding offices in other micronations outside of Talossa? In other words, could you please explain this 'conflict of interest' that you see and I don't? 1. I am suggesting that the wording can be improved. 2. On a personal note, I also feel that multiple citizenship in many micro-nations devalues the citizenship in all of them. To me, multiple citizenships is on the same level as collecting coins or stamps. ( Don't feel the need to argue the second part of my above comments - you won't be able to convince me otherwise. ) |
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Post by Sir Alexandreu Davinescu on Dec 9, 2012 17:09:13 GMT -6
25RZ50, the Semi-Permeable Wall Act actually remains intact. 1. This act leaves the definition of micronation and the semi-permeable wall act intact, since these are separate issues and may be dealt with in another bill. Just saying it does not make it so! Fundamental to the Wall is the idea that we shouldn't assume that a micronation is legitimate until proven otherwise, but rather that we should assume a micronation is illegitimate until proven otherwise. If it truly is a concern to someone, then they can easily (and privately) petition for the country to be added to the whitelist. This has never happened. Whatever the original intent of the Wall - and I agree that it was probably spite by Ben - it has nonetheless been a good thing for Talossa. I think it's one of the reasons that the nation has survived through rough times. |
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Post by Eðo Grischun on Dec 9, 2012 17:11:39 GMT -6
(in reply to Mick)
No intention of arguing this particular point with you. I was just wanting a bit of clarification on where you where coming from/standing at.
I still don't see how it's a 'conflict of interest' to be honest (unless we had a citizen who was foreign minister for two countries at the same time and was communicating between the two on behalf of each).
I'm not into the 'coin collecting' myself, in so much that I don't want to amass as many cit'ships as humanly possible, but I do see the value in 'owning' two or three premium edition stamps or coins (ie: If there are Talossa-like entities out there).
I agree that this bill needs some work before going to vote but I do understand the author's are not first-language Englishers.
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Glüc da Dhi
Secretary of State
Posts: 6,112
Talossan Since: 5-14-2009
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Post by Glüc da Dhi on Dec 9, 2012 17:14:43 GMT -6
This act (as far as I see) doesnt change anything about the legitimacy of other micronations. It just makes it easier for Talossans to join them.
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Dec 9, 2012 17:17:03 GMT -6
I still don't see how it's a 'conflict of interest' to be honest (unless we had a citizen who was foreign minister for two countries at the same time and was communicating between the two on behalf of each). This was my initial concern . Something along the idea of "One cannot serve two masters". |
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Glüc da Dhi
Secretary of State
Posts: 6,112
Talossan Since: 5-14-2009
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Post by Glüc da Dhi on Dec 9, 2012 17:20:43 GMT -6
That is technically impossible since according to 25RZ50 the Kingdom cannot have diplomatic relations with other micronations. And even if that one is ever repealed we can always make specific legislation to prevent our minister of foreign affairs or PM from being PM in another nation (or something similar) instead of banning all Talossans from holding office in any other nation.
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Post by Eiric S. Börnatfiglheu on Dec 9, 2012 17:22:08 GMT -6
I still don't see how it's a 'conflict of interest' to be honest (unless we had a citizen who was foreign minister for two countries at the same time and was communicating between the two on behalf of each). This was my initial concern . Something along the idea of "One cannot serve two masters". Can't the sitting government be trusted not to appoint such a person? |
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Dec 9, 2012 17:23:46 GMT -6
This was my initial concern . Something along the idea of "One cannot serve two masters". Can't the sitting government be trusted not to appoint such a person? What if they are elected? |
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Post by Eðo Grischun on Dec 9, 2012 17:32:44 GMT -6
That is technically impossible since according to 25RZ50 the Kingdom cannot have diplomatic relations with other micronations. And even if that one is ever repealed we can always make specific legislation to prevent our minister of foreign affairs or PM from being PM in another nation (or something similar) instead of banning all Talossans from holding office in any other nation. That's a fair point. I think a conflict would only arise if the dual citizen was an irresponsible sort to begin with. We have our own ways to deal with this. However, the real issue is larger than that - it's about freedom. I should be free to do as I please on another forum for another micronation if I wish. Might the authors permit my co-sponsoring of this bill? |
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Post by Eiric S. Börnatfiglheu on Dec 9, 2012 17:47:49 GMT -6
Can't the sitting government be trusted not to appoint such a person? What if they are elected? Haven't the RUMP been setting a goodly deal of stock on their governmental legitimacy on the fact they have been handily elected? Shall we set the will of the electorate aside when inconvenient? I think we can trust the people as well. |
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Dec 9, 2012 17:58:19 GMT -6
What if they are elected? Haven't the RUMP been setting a goodly deal of stock on their governmental legitimacy on the fact they have been handily elected? Shall we set the will of the electorate aside when inconvenient? I think we can trust the people as well. This is a personal reason, not a RUMP issue. |
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Post by Eiric S. Börnatfiglheu on Dec 9, 2012 17:59:23 GMT -6
But if we're going to trust the electorate on one thing. Should we not on others as well?
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