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Post by Dréu Gavárþic'h on Sept 8, 2007 5:57:36 GMT -6
My name is Alexandreu Gavárþic'h If it so please the Squirrel King of Arms, I request the assistance of the College in designing and obtaining arms for myself and my lawful heirs. My favorite colors are Blue and Orange. I have a draft, I made on photoshop, however, I don't think that the design is that good, and would like to improve it. (Take away that castle thing, etc.) here it is: I would like to switch the orange and the blue (so the orange is that little square and the blue takes up most of the shield, and maybe put a star of david in the square, and get rid of those three circles.) But I'm open to any suggestions (also, that castle has to go...it only seemed like a good idea at the time).
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Hooligan
Squirrel King of Arms; Cunstaval to Maricopa
Posts: 7,325
Talossan Since: 7-12-2005
Motto: PRIMA CAPIAM POCULA
Baron Since: 11-20-2005
Count Since: 9-8-2012
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Post by Hooligan on Sept 8, 2007 11:48:38 GMT -6
Azul Alexandreu --
The Squirrel King of Arms will surely reply to your request at his earliest convenience. I wish to point out here, however, that orange (or, in heraldic terms, "tenne") is not allowed on Talossan arms, so some other tincture would need to replace that. Lettering (you have an "AS" in the base) is also not permitted. Your initial thoughts and draft are a great starting point, and should allow the college to get right to work with you to finalise a design for your achievement.
Columcille Pursuivant
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Post by Dréu Gavárþic'h on Sept 8, 2007 11:58:18 GMT -6
why isn't tenne allowed?
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Post by Dréu Gavárþic'h on Sept 8, 2007 12:43:34 GMT -6
My second draft: This one's a little better don't you think?
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Hooligan
Squirrel King of Arms; Cunstaval to Maricopa
Posts: 7,325
Talossan Since: 7-12-2005
Motto: PRIMA CAPIAM POCULA
Baron Since: 11-20-2005
Count Since: 9-8-2012
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Post by Hooligan on Sept 8, 2007 13:13:36 GMT -6
Well, more bad news for you, I'm afraid. :-) The tincture rule of heraldry forbids the use of colour on colour, which is to say that you cannot have a blue charge (your star) on a red field (the canton). There are four tincture groups in heraldry -- colours, metals, furs, and stains -- and one may never have a colour on top of a colour, nor a metal on top of a metal. The two metals are argent (white or silver) and or (yellow or gold). The colours allowed in Talossan heraldry are sable (black), gules (red), azure (blue), and vert (green). Talossan heraldry also recognizes two furs -- ermine and vair (and its variant, potent). Talossan heraldry (to answer your earlier question) does not allow any of the tinctures which are "stains" (one of which is tenne). So the colour of the star, if you wish to put it onto a gules (red) canton would need to be white or yellow (that is, silver or gold). The fact that a red canton is on top of a blue field is another, larger violation of the tincture rule, though, and so my recommendation would be (although I rush to say that this discussion is all premature, as the Squirrel King will need to respond to your request and assign a member of the college to your case) would be that you consider a canton that is yellow or white, so that the blue star can sit upon it. I would wish to defer to more knowledgeable members of the College of Arms, but my own opinion is that what would be blazoned as "two swords inverted argent, crossed in saltire and enflamed or" are legal and could be emblazoned. However, swords crossed in saltire are rather hackneyed in the Kingdom (that is, we already have a rather surprising number of citizens who have this particular device on their arms), and although the call is yours, of course, the College may wish to consult with you on a more unique choice for your central charge. As I say, the Herald, Pursuivant, or Fellow of the College to whom the Squirrel King assigns your case will be able to work directly with you on all these issues. Columcille
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Post by Dréu Gavárþic'h on Sept 8, 2007 13:19:53 GMT -6
sigh... how about a silver star on a blue background small square with something else on the main part. I'll come up with something...
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Post by Dréu Gavárþic'h on Sept 8, 2007 13:20:24 GMT -6
Who makes these rules?
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Hooligan
Squirrel King of Arms; Cunstaval to Maricopa
Posts: 7,325
Talossan Since: 7-12-2005
Motto: PRIMA CAPIAM POCULA
Baron Since: 11-20-2005
Count Since: 9-8-2012
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Post by Hooligan on Sept 8, 2007 13:31:17 GMT -6
The rules of heraldry were made a thousand or more years ago. We don't make them, we just follow them. They are good rules, tried and true. Columcille
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Post by Dréu Gavárþic'h on Sept 8, 2007 13:46:00 GMT -6
third draft: The star of david is a little weird but I'm sure that can be corrected
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Hooligan
Squirrel King of Arms; Cunstaval to Maricopa
Posts: 7,325
Talossan Since: 7-12-2005
Motto: PRIMA CAPIAM POCULA
Baron Since: 11-20-2005
Count Since: 9-8-2012
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Post by Hooligan on Sept 8, 2007 13:50:03 GMT -6
The tincture rule, of course, is still an issue, since you have red (griffon) on blue (field), and blue (star) on black (canton), and black (canton) on blue (field).
Change the canton and the griffon to a metallic tincture (argent or or), and you have a legal draft there.
Or, alternately, change the field and the star to metallic; same result -- a legal draft.
From here, I am sure that whomever the Squirrel King assigns to your case can work with you, and at this point I will await that action.
Columcille
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Post by Dréu Gavárþic'h on Sept 8, 2007 14:11:18 GMT -6
Alright, how about a silver star with a blue canton, and a silver field with a red beastie. Would that be legal?
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Post by Dréu Gavárþic'h on Sept 8, 2007 14:11:48 GMT -6
Except the star should have blue holes in it like the second draft does
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Sept 8, 2007 14:13:31 GMT -6
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Post by Dréu Gavárþic'h on Sept 8, 2007 14:14:39 GMT -6
I'm pretty sure my latter request is legal
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Post by Dréu Gavárþic'h on Sept 8, 2007 15:59:45 GMT -6
Okay, here's what I want in complete heraldry form:
Paly of 5 argent and azure, a bordure of the first with a gules beastie
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