Ian Plätschisch
Senator for Maritiimi-Maxhestic
Posts: 4,001
Talossan Since: 3-21-2015
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Post by Ian Plätschisch on Mar 11, 2016 21:30:38 GMT -6
Modify on all articles except XIX and XXI
Per on XIX and XXI.
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Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN
Seneschal
the new Jim Hacker
Posts: 6,635
Talossan Since: 6-25-2004
Dame Since: 9-8-2012
Motto: Expulseascâ, reveneascâ
Baron Since: Feudal titles are for gimps
Duke Since: Feudal titles are for gimps
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Post by Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN on Mar 11, 2016 21:37:52 GMT -6
VIII: Modify IX: Per X: Per XI: Modify XII: Modify XIII : Modify XIV: Per XV: Modify XVI: Modify XVII: Per XVIII: Per XIX: Modify XX: Per XXI: Per
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Prince Patrick
Citizen since 8-23-2005; Prince since 3-14-2007; Duke since 8-6-2011
Citizen and Governor of Florencia; His Highness, Prince Patrick, Duke of Florencia
Posts: 208
Duke Since: 8-6-2011
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Post by Prince Patrick on Mar 12, 2016 13:37:33 GMT -6
May I suggest sending out an email and giving a couple of more days for the vote?
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Dame Litz Cjantscheir, UrN
Puisne Justice; Chancellor of the Royal Talossan Bar; Cunstaval to Florencia
Dame & Former Seneschal
Posts: 1,157
Talossan Since: 4-5-2010
Dame Since: 9-8-2012
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Post by Dame Litz Cjantscheir, UrN on Mar 24, 2016 9:05:05 GMT -6
Modify for all.
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Dr. Txec dal Nordselvă
Puisne (Associate) Justice of the Uppermost Court
Fraichetz dels punts, es non dels mürs
Posts: 4,063
Talossan Since: 9-23-2012
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Post by Dr. Txec dal Nordselvă on Mar 24, 2016 9:10:02 GMT -6
I think we've waited long enough. How do we want to get to work on modifying the Articles?
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Dame Litz Cjantscheir, UrN
Puisne Justice; Chancellor of the Royal Talossan Bar; Cunstaval to Florencia
Dame & Former Seneschal
Posts: 1,157
Talossan Since: 4-5-2010
Dame Since: 9-8-2012
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Post by Dame Litz Cjantscheir, UrN on Mar 24, 2016 9:43:51 GMT -6
Draw up a list of Articles that need to be modified and each member can deliver (in .pdf format etc...) a report of what they would like to see modified in each article. Once all reports have been submitted the Chair picks a article and each member can discuss based of their own and others' reports.
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Dr. Txec dal Nordselvă
Puisne (Associate) Justice of the Uppermost Court
Fraichetz dels punts, es non dels mürs
Posts: 4,063
Talossan Since: 9-23-2012
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Post by Dr. Txec dal Nordselvă on Mar 24, 2016 10:52:36 GMT -6
Here is a list of how the commission voted on all the articles:
I - remove II - modify III - modify IV - modify V - modify VI - modify VII - modify VII - modify IX - modify X - modify XI - modify XII - modify XIV - modify XVI - modify XVII - modify XVIII - modify XIX - modify XX - modify XXI - per
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Dame Litz Cjantscheir, UrN
Puisne Justice; Chancellor of the Royal Talossan Bar; Cunstaval to Florencia
Dame & Former Seneschal
Posts: 1,157
Talossan Since: 4-5-2010
Dame Since: 9-8-2012
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Post by Dame Litz Cjantscheir, UrN on Mar 24, 2016 12:11:28 GMT -6
Safe to say Article I and XXI can be removed from the list.
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Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN
Seneschal
the new Jim Hacker
Posts: 6,635
Talossan Since: 6-25-2004
Dame Since: 9-8-2012
Motto: Expulseascâ, reveneascâ
Baron Since: Feudal titles are for gimps
Duke Since: Feudal titles are for gimps
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Post by Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN on Mar 24, 2016 18:50:28 GMT -6
Can I suggest that we get on this now and make sure we have a timetable by which we can produce a report by the end of April? With it being unlikely that the Free Democrats will be in the next Government, there is no reason to believe we will get another extension.
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Ian Plätschisch
Senator for Maritiimi-Maxhestic
Posts: 4,001
Talossan Since: 3-21-2015
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Post by Ian Plätschisch on Mar 24, 2016 19:15:18 GMT -6
Can I suggest that we get on this now and make sure we have a timetable by which we can produce a report by the end of April? With it being unlikely that the Free Democrats will be in the next Government, there is no reason to believe we will get another extension. Why not? I know you believe that the RUMP is dead-set opposed to the Commission, but I'm not convinced that is true. If our aim really is to improve the Organic Law (in as much of a non-partisan way as possible, namely by condensing and moving stuff to el Lexhatx, modernizing parts of it, making it more clear, etc), then why would RUMP Seneschal not at least give the Commission a chance to present their work?
This is not to say that we should purposefully go slow when not necessary, of course.
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Dr. Txec dal Nordselvă
Puisne (Associate) Justice of the Uppermost Court
Fraichetz dels punts, es non dels mürs
Posts: 4,063
Talossan Since: 9-23-2012
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Post by Dr. Txec dal Nordselvă on Mar 25, 2016 5:16:42 GMT -6
Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN , Sir C. M. Siervicül , Dame Litz Cjantscheir, UrN , Nicholas Hayes , Ieremiac'h Ventrutx , Prince Patrick , Ian PlätschischOk, so everyone please prepare a report of the changes you feel are necessary to the OrgLaw. Let's try to get our individual reports submitted either via PM or email (txec @ kingdomoftalossa.net) and I will forward each report on as I get them to the rest of the commission. I will also compile each report so a comparison can easily be made. Please submit reports no later than ten days from now, April 4.
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Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN
Seneschal
the new Jim Hacker
Posts: 6,635
Talossan Since: 6-25-2004
Dame Since: 9-8-2012
Motto: Expulseascâ, reveneascâ
Baron Since: Feudal titles are for gimps
Duke Since: Feudal titles are for gimps
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Post by Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN on Mar 25, 2016 16:23:38 GMT -6
Just sent my report round.
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Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN
Seneschal
the new Jim Hacker
Posts: 6,635
Talossan Since: 6-25-2004
Dame Since: 9-8-2012
Motto: Expulseascâ, reveneascâ
Baron Since: Feudal titles are for gimps
Duke Since: Feudal titles are for gimps
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Post by Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN on Mar 27, 2016 14:55:38 GMT -6
Posting it here for the benefit of the public.
===
PRELIMINARY NOTES: I am of course a Republican, but this is not a proposal for a Republican reform since we are in a small minority on this Commission. What this proposes is to keep the bare-bones of the monarchic principle intact, but to move all the details to El Lexhátx. I envisage that this reform would be fully functional for the existing monarchy; or for a move to a different kind of monarchy; or, with mild amendments (eg copy-pasting "President" to "King" and including election provisions) even for a Republic.
I also introduce flexibility of the size of the Cosâ and the Senäts (though making sure that the former is always twice the size at least of the latter), and opening the possibility of differential votes for Senators based on province population, as has been mooted. I introduce also the option of abstaining on VoCs which would make it easier to form governments in a fragmented Cosâ.
ARTICLE II
Move sections 8-10 to El Lexhátx
ARTICLE III
3.1 Remove "hereditary" 3.4-6, 8-10 Remove and substitute with: "Succession to the Throne shall be established by law."
3.7 Amend first sentence with:
ARTICLE IV
4.6 Amend:
(explanation: allows the Ziu to introduce alternative voting systems by law, eg. IRV)
Also add new sentence to end of 4.6:
(explanation: allows the Ziu to put fees on Senäts elections, same as Cosâ elections)
ARTICLE V
5.1 Amend:
5.10 Amend first sentence:
(explanation: allows Ziu to establish weighting voting in the Senäts)
ARTICLE VI
6.2 Amend as follows:
(explanation: actual requirements for registration are moved to statute law)
ARTICLE VII
7.6 Add the following:
(explanation: some parties suggested a reform allowing the Ziu to mandate that, for example, a public vote must be expressed through the Chancery rather than posted on Witt or sent up in smoke signals or whatever. This will make this possible if the Ziu wants.)
ARTICLE VIII
8.1 Amend:
(explanation: makes number of Cosâ seats flexible)
New section after VIII.2:
(explanation: allows the Ziu to mandate party candidate lists, either binding or non-binding)
Amend VIII.3:
New section 8.7
(explanation: establishes the Túischac'h on exactly the same basis as the Mençéi)O
ARTICLE XI
XI.2: Amend to
(explanation: the Seneschál will be elected by the Cosâ.)
XI.5 Amend to:
(explanation: downgrades the function of PDs. They are no longer full laws and can only supplement El Lexhátx rather than amend, repeal or add to it. Thus Seneschál can no longer rule by decree.)
ARTICLE XII
XII.3-7 Delete / move to El Lexhátx.
Explanation: these sections Organically dictate what Cabinet portfolios there must be. This is useless.
XII.9 (on Túischac'h:) Delete (replaced by new 8.7 above)
ARTICLE XIII
XIII.6 Amend to read:
(explanation: in most countries abstaining on a VoC is an option. This will help form governments in future fragmented Cosâs - i.e. a party may decide to allow even their sworn enemies to form a government in the interests of stability by abstaining on the VoC.)
ARTICLE XIV
Replace in entirety with:
ARTICLE XV: I withhold my suggestions on this section until such time as we learn whether the King will proclaim 48RZ14 or not.
ARTICLE XVI:
XVI.1 Amend to read:
(explanation: life terms are nonsense. No UC Justice has ever stayed in office until death.)
XVI.2. Amend to read:
(explanation: the current Cort agreed that Organic cases should be heard by three justices in the first instance and five on appeal, which I think is an excellent rule which should be enshrined.
XVI.4 Delete words "for life" in line 3.
ARTICLE XVII
XVII.9 Delete words "shall serve as Military Governor and".
Add sentence: (48RZ27, thou art avenged!)
ARTICLE XIX
Delete Second Covenant except for: "No religious or ideological organisation shall be "established" by law".
(explanation: the rest of the Second Covenant institutionalises the principle of opposition to affirmative action. This is a shibboleth of American conservative politics that has no place in Talossa.)
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Dr. Txec dal Nordselvă
Puisne (Associate) Justice of the Uppermost Court
Fraichetz dels punts, es non dels mürs
Posts: 4,063
Talossan Since: 9-23-2012
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Post by Dr. Txec dal Nordselvă on Mar 29, 2016 10:30:33 GMT -6
Dame Miestra, I support all of your proposed changes with the exception of your new Section 8.7. I do not like the idea of a Senator becoming Tuischach. I believe the Speaker of the Cosa should be a member of the Cosa. So, my report will mirror yours except I will not support the change I've mentioned.
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Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN
Seneschal
the new Jim Hacker
Posts: 6,635
Talossan Since: 6-25-2004
Dame Since: 9-8-2012
Motto: Expulseascâ, reveneascâ
Baron Since: Feudal titles are for gimps
Duke Since: Feudal titles are for gimps
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Post by Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN on Mar 29, 2016 15:15:11 GMT -6
MIÉIDÂ! Sorry, that's a typo on my part. I just cut and pasted the electing a Mençéi section. I didn't mean that to happen. Will revise.
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