Senate Election Reform Proposal

[kri]

Azul!

As promised, here is my suggestion for Senate election reforms. Go ahead, rip it to shreds. ;-)

Seriously, let's see if we can get a consensus here before I submit it to the Ziu in August.

Ben

*******

RZ___ The Senate Elections Reform (Amendment) Act

WHEREAS, the checks and balances surrounding Senate elections in the Organic Law were vitiated through partisan “reforms” aimed at centralizing power in the hands of the Secretary of State and the PC Party, and

WHEREAS, the resulting system is open to flagrant abuse such as “secret” elections and the partisan manipulation of election schedules, and

WHEREAS, a national consensus exists to restore a system of checks and balances, and to ensure fully democratic, representative elections to the Upper House,

THEREFORE, the Ziu hereby approves this Act and orders its transmittal to the voters for their verdict in the next general election.

Be it hereby enacted:

Article IV of the Organic Law is hereby repealed. In its place the following text is inserted:

Art.IV:Sec.1. The Senäts, or in English the Senate, is the national legislative council and the upper house of the Ziu, and shall be composed of one Senator elected from each province.

Art.IV:Sec.2. Elections for the filling of places in the Senats shall be conducted by the Secretary of State in accordance with election law. These elections shall be conducted simultaneously with general elections to the Cosâ.

Art.IV:Sec.3. Each time the Cosâ shall be dissolved, there shall be an election for the Senats in two provinces. For purposes of elections to the Senats, the provinces shall be listed in the following fixed order: Vuode, Atatürk, Cézembre, Florencia, Maricopa, Maritiimi-Maxhestic, Mussolini. Following the passage of this Act, the next elections for the Senats shall be held in the two provinces for whom the greatest amount of time has elapsed since the last election for the Senats.

Art.IV:Sec.4. Any Talossan citizen is free to contest an election for the Senats in any province. Election ballots shall guarantee the right of all citizens in all provinces to vote for an individual Senator for their province.

Art.IV:Sec.5. Political parties may “endorse” individual candidates for the Senate, one candidate per party per province. In the event that a voter does not specify an individual candidate for Senate on his ballot, his vote for a political party shall apply to the candidate endorsed by that party. A voter may always vote for a different Senate candidate than the one endorsed by the party of his choice, by indicating said candidate on the ballot.

Art.IV:Sec.6. The candidate receiving a plurality of the vote shall be declared the winner. In case of a tie between two or more candidates, the executive officer of the province shall select one of those candidates to be the Senator.

Art.IV:Sec.7. Voting is not secret. As soon as one’s vote is cast, it becomes public knowledge.

Art.IV:Sec.8. If a voter returns more than one vote, the first one cast is counted and the others are ignored.

Art.IV:Sec.9. When the Election Deadline has passed, a final tally of votes is publicly announced. Any votes arriving after the Deadline, even if they were posted before the Deadline, are null and void.

Art.IV:Sec.10. If a seat becomes vacant during the term of a Senator, the King shall appoint a Senator to fill the remainder of the term. The King must appoint the individual designated to him by the political party with which the outgoing Senator was commonly associated. If this is impossible, the King shall appoint the individual designated to him by the executive officer of the province.

Art.IV:Sec.11. Senators may be removed from office by the Uppermost Cort, for criminal activity or for mis-, mal-, or non-feasance.

****

Uréu q’estadra så: Robert I, King of Talossa

[Danihel Laurieir]

My suggestions for Senats reform:

1. Completely divorce the Senats from the Provinces.

2. Make the Senats a chamber composed of elder Talossan states-people.

3. Limit Senats power to vetoing Cosa legislation by a supermajority.

Here's how I'd like to see it: There'd be 5 senators, each with a long history of involvement with the Kingdom. They'd be elected once a year--on Talossa's birthday--in a nationwide vote. Evey citizen could vote for two Senators...the top five vote-getters would get Senats seats.

When 4 of them agreed, they could veto any legislation originated from the Cosa or any Prime Dictate of the PM's. The Senats would not hold votes of confidence.

Under this scheme, the Senats would represent an elite of proven Talossan activity and loyalty and--while the Cosa would remain the place where most of the real action is--the Senats would serve as the Super Ego to the Cosa's (much more fun) Id and Ego.

One beneficial side effect of some arrangment like this would be to lessen the King's burden in having to strike down idiotic legislation. There'd be a wider circle of autocratic bastards to take the heat.

Well?

[kri]

Azul,

> 1. Completely divorce the Senats from the Provinces.

This is the one thing I really like about the Senate! It splits people up into separate provincial electorates from time to time and really provides the only entertainment we see on a provincial level. Aside from the asinine 'reforms' that allowed Furxheir to screw with senate elections, I think this part of the system really fulfils its proper function, which is to make Talossa more fun.

> 2. Make the Senats a chamber composed of elder Talossan states-people.

Hmmm... I thought about this, it would be analogous to the (pre-1945) Hungarian Senate. Former Prime Ministers, Cort Justices, that sort of thing. I don't necessarily have a problem with this, I just think an elected Senate is more interesting.

But more on this below...

> 3. Limit Senats power to vetoing Cosa legislation by a supermajority.

Aha--the VETORIUM! I remember this from days gone by... ;-)

> Here's how I'd like to see it: There'd be 5 senators, each with a long history of involvement with the Kingdom. They'd be elected once a year--on Talossa's birthday--in a nationwide vote. Evey citizen could vote for two Senators...the top five vote-getters would get Senats seats.

Reminds me of the Philippine senate... 100 seats, the top 100 vote-getters become senators in a nationwide election! So you have film stars getting elected routinely... Good thing Talossa has no film stars.

> Under this scheme, the Senats would represent an elite of proven Talossan activity and loyalty and--while the Cosa would remain the place where most of the real action is--the Senats would serve as the Super Ego to the Cosa's (much more fun) Id and Ego.

I don't think this would necessarily bring about the benefits it's intended to. No systemic thing or legal fixture is ever going to generate or ensure loyalty. We had a consensus-driven, democratically-referendumed, Furxheir-amended, PC senate, PC-friendly Cort type constitution, and *that* didn't ensure loyalty of any sort. I admire the suggestion, I guess we're just disagreeing over what the ultimate purpose of the Senate should be.

> One beneficial side effect of some arrangment like this would be to lessen the King's burden in having to strike down idiotic legislation. There'd be a wider circle of autocratic bastards to take the heat.

Since I don't think I've vetoed a bill in something like five years, this is not really a burning issue, is it? I'm not arguing, I guess I just don't see this as a problem.

The problem that happened in June had nothing to do with Talossa's constitution or laws. It had to do with the fact that we had a "bad electorate" as far as some people were concerned, so they quit. No amount of legal tinkering is going to remedy the problems that arise when people have no conscience.

Ben

[Danihel Laurieir]

Ben, your criticisms of my "vetorium" Senats are right if you take my goal to be making an institution that will insure Talossan loyalty. But that's not what motivates my suggestions at all.

You are absolutely right that no institutional reform could have prevented the exodus. And I have zero interest in trying to "reform" Talossa in response to what happened. Instead, my suggestions for Senats reform come from my long-held view that the Cosa such be the preeminent Talossan governmental forum.

I think the Provinces are a distraction, and therefore I really don't like linking the Senats to them. Furthermore, in the Talossan context I really don't understand the need for two legislative bodies...especially when they essentially do the same thing.

But I do like the idea of somehow privileging Talossa's steady old hands and giving them some means of preventing Talossa from doing really stupid things. Therefore: the Senats as vetorium.

And just to clarify: under my idea, the Senats would be elected. To qualify to run you'd have to meet a higher standard of activity and longevity than you would if you ran for the Cosa.

But--to put all this Senats stuff aside for the moment--I really think we here in the Kingdom out to focus on making the Cosa a better legislative body...

As I've already suggested, let's make a statute book--not just a list of passed legislation--but a real statute book. Let's incorporate some sort of committee review process for proposed bills so that errors, kinks and felicitious compromises can be worked out in advance. Let's have some sort of dedicated web place for the Cosa, complete with a message board dedicated exclusively to Cosa business and links to current law, the Organic law and Cort decisions.

In short, let's screw the Senats and concentrate on the Cosa!

[kri]

Azul,


> Instead, my suggestions for Senats reform come from my long-held view that the Cosa such be the preeminent Talossan governmental forum.

I think, sort of by default, it is--Senate elections have traditionally been much more sedate, almost "private" affairs, so the Cosâ gets all the attention when it comes to elections and, I think, when it comes to doing business. (Ironically, of course, my proposal modifies this very fact...)

> I think the Provinces are a distraction, and therefore I really don't like linking the Senats to them. Furthermore, in the Talossan context I really don't understand the need for two legislative bodies...especially when they essentially do the same thing.

THAT is a much more interesting point than the whole general election tinkering issue. I think this needs wider discussion, frankly. Good to bring it up.

> But I do like the idea of somehow privileging Talossa's steady old hands and giving them some means of preventing Talossa from doing really stupid things. Therefore: the Senats as vetorium.

That was originally the idea with the Senäts, insofar as you had to pass various hurdles to get in (two years experience as a Talossan or six months as PM, etc.) but in practice it hasn't worked out that way, chiefly from time to time because of lack of personnel.

> And just to clarify: under my idea, the Senats would be elected. To qualify to run you'd have to meet a higher standard of activity and longevity than you would if you ran for the Cosa.

Again, that's already the law, it's just that there are exceptions to the law that allow 'lesser' people to be Senators in case of necessity.

> As I've already suggested, let's make a statute book--not just a list of passed legislation--but a real statute book. Let's incorporate some sort of committee review process for proposed bills so that errors, kinks and felicitious compromises can be worked out in advance. Let's have some sort of dedicated web place for the Cosa, complete with a message board dedicated exclusively to Cosa business and links to current law, the Organic law and Cort decisions.

We've tried to do things like this in the past--in the most recent celebrated case, Martin-Pierre and I worked out, in excruciating detail, the whole provincial election reform package, on Wittenberg. Then when he proposed it, he changed the whole thing to fit his own ideas and put my name on it!

I thoroughly agree, it's better to hash out legislation here on Witt rather than just have it dumped in people's laps on the first of the month. I don't think we've ever had the population to justify having a separate board though... just one more click to have to make to get where you want to go.

Ben

[inksplash]

Actually, what I would like to see enshrined in Talossan law is a slightly different way of looking at the Senats -- by divorcing it from the PARTIES.

The Cosa represents all the voters in a general election, proportional to party turnout. Party membership is determined by who votes for them in general elections, and the parties primarily represent those who voted for them (but should keep the kingdom's best intrests in mind as well)

The Senats primarily represents ALL the citizens in their province, and the interests of their provinces -- regardless of party affiliation, or level of individual activity -- but again, of course, with the Kingdom's best interests in mind. Senators should keep this in mind.

So, in theory, each individual citizen should have two people in the Ziu looking out for their interests -- the MC from the party perspective, and the Senator from the provincial perspective. Unless said citizen gets 'double lucky' by having one person wearing two hats in the Ziu.

The provincial 'parties' created for Senatorial races shouldn't be linked to national parties, and really don't do anything anyway. So, omit them. When you vote for a Senator, you should be voting for a PERSON.

This should balance with the Cosa, where you vote for a PARTY.

-=-=-=- Gary -=-=-=-

Senechal del Regipats Talossan

[kri]

Azul Gary!

Great to see you back!

As to the partisan/nonpartisan nature of the Senate, my proposal leaves this up to the electorate themselves. If an "independent" candidate wants to run without any party backing, and can convince the majority in his province to elect him, he's elected.

Or, if a candidate wants a party endorsement, he can go that route as well. Whichever option the individual voter chooses to back, is the one that will earn his vote.

Ben