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Post by Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. on Nov 7, 2012 13:56:11 GMT -6
Azure Mullets Fig.1 Attachments:
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Post by Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. on Nov 7, 2012 13:57:27 GMT -6
Azure Mullets Fig. 2 ... Wouldn't recommend Sable Mullets . . . it looks horrendous Attachments:
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Nov 7, 2012 16:01:41 GMT -6
I do not agree, the owl used in the diagram is the Talossan owl from a previously granted arms... in case it is required to be changed then the previous armiger may also be called in to re-forge his escutcheon and stitch his coat of arms. I'm just the message bearer on this one. I'll leave it at that.
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Nov 7, 2012 20:25:41 GMT -6
Ok, update.
The Owl's going to be ok.
or is going to have to be the standard, previously accepted hue. .
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Post by Martì Vataldestreça on Nov 8, 2012 6:58:23 GMT -6
Sorry for not getting back to people, had a busy couple of days!
I like the azure mullets - I don't mind which hue is used, just as long as it contrasts sufficiently from the hue of or that ends up being used.
As for the owl, I also don't mind which owl is used.
Martì
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Sir C. M. Siervicül
Posts: 9,636
Talossan Since: 8-13-2005
Knight Since: 7-28-2007
Motto: Nonnisi Deo serviendum
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Post by Sir C. M. Siervicül on Nov 8, 2012 19:46:15 GMT -6
or is going to have to be the standard, previously accepted hue. . Which one is that? About six different hues of or have been previously accepted in various grants. And the rule has always been that the emblazoner has some discretion in the shades of tinctures and metals as long as they can't be confused with a different one. Ben's latest shade of or looks pretty close to the one in Ventrutx's arms. I think the gules mullets look pretty good, now that contrast is enhanced by the truer or. Maybe could be even better with a slightly deeper shade of gules though.
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Nov 9, 2012 8:49:29 GMT -6
or is going to have to be the standard, previously accepted hue. . Which one is that? ( points) That one, over there! ========================== As for a more serious answer- of course, depending on which program you use , the actual interpretation of the hue is going to be slightly different. And as we view the CoA from our desks, our equipment we use ( monitor, graphics card, etc) are going to display the hue with subtle differences. Perhaps if we set the standard " gold" ( for our records ) as the Hex Color Code #FFD700. This is the base for our work here. Edit: code found here, for reference : www.w3schools.com/html/html_colornames.asp(We won't have to go back and adjust any current CoA, of course.) This would be slightly flexible. Just as an artist's Gold in York is different than one in London and different than one in Paris, we can adapt. But at least we now have a standard, and we are all on the same page? Edit : ( By page, I mean like a page in a book. Not like a teenager that is helping around the Kingdom)
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Post by Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. on Nov 9, 2012 12:33:14 GMT -6
Standards... flexibility... its getting complicated... This uses all pure colours/metals... Changed the mullets to azure at the request of the prospective armiger... [However I am not in for standardization... I wish to start a Civil War... Hey Maurice G, where art thou? ] Attachments:
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Nov 10, 2012 1:51:56 GMT -6
Standards... flexibility... its getting complicated... This uses all pure colours/metals... Changed the mullets to azure at the request of the prospective armiger... [However I am not in for standardization... I wish to start a Civil War... Hey Maurice G, where art thou? ] Well, you know ... as the Dean I have to make sure that every submitted CoA request meets the requirements of the College. Which means "or" is "or" , no matter who posts it. If the SKA and the King want continuity, then that's what we get (smiles).
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Post by Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. on Nov 10, 2012 6:10:47 GMT -6
...no matter who posts it. If the SKA and the King want continuity, then that's what we get (smiles). These are strange words... Till date we have seen the two Kings (I mean the King and the Squirrel King) grant and proceed with petitions having variants of the specified colour/metals... Why is the special objections? Is it because I said that I'd try to get the 'orange' approved as Gold... This is indeed strange reaction when the College and the Kingdom has been granting different hues, but even when I come up with a colour which looks orange, but is an accepted hue of gold, and even named so, then the rejection of the same is not proper...
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Sir C. M. Siervicül
Posts: 9,636
Talossan Since: 8-13-2005
Knight Since: 7-28-2007
Motto: Nonnisi Deo serviendum
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Post by Sir C. M. Siervicül on Nov 10, 2012 11:29:17 GMT -6
Arms Rules, II.4. Contrast: "Each tincture used in Talossan armory may be depicted in a variety of shades, but contrast is determined by the traditional heraldic categorization of tinctures as colors (dark) and metals (light)."
Squirrel King of Arms, 11 Mar 2012: "Well, 'or' means 'any shade of yellow or gold.'"
The King (then Blanc Wolf Herald), 6 Jan 2006: "Heraldic tinctures are not sharply defined. When a blazon specifies vert, the green has to be green enough not to be confused with blue (or any other heraldic tincture), but that's about it — it can be anywhere from a sort of deep forest to a bright grass green. And the same is true for the other colours. Or and argent — the metals — give the artist even more freedom. Or is gold or yellow, and argent is silver or white or light grey."
We'd also do well to recall the precedent of S:reu Scurznicol's arms, appearing in just the last honours list, where the College accommodated his request for a darker-than-usual shade of or to match the arms of his alma mater. So, there has never been any suggestion of standardising the tinctures in Talossan heraldry. Rather, artistic license has always been the rule, limited only by the principle that each tincture must be presented in a shade that is not so close to another tincture as to cause confusion about which tincture is intended.
Here, it seems that the "Bright California Gold" color is so orange as to potentially cause confusion with tenné, notwithstanding that some unknown party (possibly a paint company marketing guy) named it as "gold."
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Nov 10, 2012 11:39:57 GMT -6
I appreciate the comments! Please note : Perhaps if we set the standard " gold" ( for our records ) as the Hex Color Code #FFD700. This is the base for our work here. This would be slightly flexible. Just as an artist's Gold in York is different than one in London and different than one in Paris, we can adapt. But at least we now have a standard, and we are all on the same page? I hope that members of the College were not interpreting this as "There is only one acceptable or, and it's this or". What I was trying to convey is that there is a starting point for a tincture. If we all start at that same point, then we can also adapt a tincture from there.
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Post by Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. on Nov 10, 2012 12:29:44 GMT -6
Here, it seems that the "Bright California Gold" color is so orange as to potentially cause confusion with tenné, notwithstanding that some unknown party (possibly a paint company marketing guy) named it as "gold." Point taken. I rest without any further arguments except reminding that the shade by that name has been in existence since atleast 1952.
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Sir C. M. Siervicül
Posts: 9,636
Talossan Since: 8-13-2005
Knight Since: 7-28-2007
Motto: Nonnisi Deo serviendum
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Post by Sir C. M. Siervicül on Nov 11, 2012 21:02:39 GMT -6
What is was trying to convey is that there is a starting point for a tincture. If we all start at that same point, then we can also adapt a tincture from there. Got it. The "standard" is kind of the archetypal representation of a tincture, and while other shades are acceptable, the farther you get from the standard the more likely it is that you are getting confusingly close to a different tincture. That makes sense.
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Capt. Sir Mick Preston
Capitán of the Zouaves
Posts: 6,511
Talossan Since: 9-21-2006
Knight Since: 10-12-2010
Motto: Cuimhnichibh air na daoine bho'n d'thainig sibh
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Post by Capt. Sir Mick Preston on Nov 12, 2012 0:34:04 GMT -6
What I was trying to convey is that there is a starting point for a tincture. If we all start at that same point, then we can also adapt a tincture from there. Got it. The "standard" is kind of the archetypal representation of a tincture, and while other shades are acceptable, the farther you get from the standard the more likely it is that you are getting confusingly close to a different tincture. That makes sense. Exactly!
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