ZRT Campaign Underway

[Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN]

The simple point is that the ZRT have offered a programme for an alternative Seneschál and cabinet, which is the Talossan meaning of "government"; the MRPT have explicitly said that that's not a priority for them. And the CSProgs and the Peculiarists haven't said anything. So we are the only alternative Seneschál and cabinet so far.

[Glüc da Dhi]

May 29, 2012 16:38:00 GMT -6 Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN said:

The simple point is that the ZRT have offered a programme for an alternative Seneschál and cabinet, which is the Talossan meaning of "government"; the MRPT have explicitly said that that's not a priority for them. And the CSProgs and the Peculiarists haven't said anything. So we are the only alternative Seneschál and cabinet so far.

I have only said that becoming the government is less important than things like electoral reform and an open and tolerant Talossan society. Do you rather want to become PM than allow dual citizenship or introduce mandatory candidate lists or repeal the semi permeable wall? Because the first option is for about 80% different people doing the same thing and the second option is really about offering Talossa an alternative.

[Hooligan]

If it will help, I would like to offer myself as the RUMP's alternative Seneschal (even if this has to be super-alternated a bit by saying that I'm actually only the RUMP's alternative to an alternative Seneschal). But if appointed, I will do my level best to serve alternatively, in some sense or other, in the hopes that doing so will help me overcome the handicap of my stale personality and stuff. :-)

(( Hool ))

[Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN]

But it's not a choice, Glüc. A ZRT government will necessarily be able to bring in electoral reform, end isolationism towards foreign micronations, etc.

[Glüc da Dhi]

May 29, 2012 17:24:42 GMT -6 Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN said:

But it's not a choice, Glüc. A ZRT government will necessarily be able to bring in electoral reform, end isolationism towards foreign micronations, etc.

For becoming the government you need:
* 101 ZRT cosa seats
For ending isolationism you need:
* 101 progressive cosa seats
* 5 progressive senators
For most kinds of electoral reform you need
* 134 cosa seats for parties that support that particular reform
* 6 senators that support that particular reform
* 2/3rds of the talossan people to support that particular reform.

So I dont see how a ZRT government leads to the other 2 things.

Sure, its not neccesarily a choice. The MRPT wants both.
But for us our manifesto is priority nr 1 and our own political ambition is priority nr 2.

Is your own ambition to become Séneschal more important than the ZRT manifesto, have you got something better than this boring play of words or will you stop the false rhetoric???

[Eiric S. Börnatfiglheu]

Gluc, we do indeed have things aside from false rhetoric. We have solid ideas that, the people willing, we can enact. Much of it overlaps with the MRPT platform and manifesto, matter of fact. We're reaching for the moon in the hopes that, should we miss, we'll land among the stars.

[Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN]

I can't understand why the ZRT is being pilloried for the - admittedly shocking and radical - concept that the people might want to change the government this election. My judgement that the rest of the Talossan opposition have simply "given up" and are prepared to let Hool and his mates run things forever seems to be confirmed.

Also, your standards for the majority that legislative reforms might need miss out the important calcuation that many RUMPers may be in favour of these reforms. Not all of them are knee-jerk reactionaries.

[Glüc da Dhi]

May 29, 2012 17:55:26 GMT -6 Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN said:

I can't understand why the ZRT is being pilloried for the - admittedly shocking and radical - concept that the people might want to change the government this election. My judgement that the rest of the Talossan opposition have simply "given up" and are prepared to let Hool and his mates run things forever seems to be confirmed.

Also, your standards for the majority that legislative reforms might need miss out the important calcuation that many RUMPers may be in favour of these reforms. Not all of them are knee-jerk reactionaries.

I dont have any problem with the ZRT wanting to change the government. The MRPT wants to change the goverment, but apparently we are not real enough, cause we even more than become the government want to change Talossa.

[Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN]

Does this mean you wouldn't be willing to form a coalition government with us?

But as I keep saying, our 50 word statement calls us "the only real alternative to continued RUMP government", not "the only real opposition party". The other opposition parties are simply not focussed on providing an alternative government, as Glüc has helpfully confirmed. Not that they're not real parties, or valuable partners in putting together a new vision for Talossa, but that they're not seriously agitating for a change in government. Can someone explain why this is offensive?

I should also note that the MRPT programme is clearly more radical than the CSProgs, which should make things easier to understand.

[Sarac'h Txilvertescu]

Ladies and Gentlemen: why the opposition never manages to work!

[Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN]

Why, Sariah?

[Sarac'h Txilvertescu]

seems like you and Glüc da Dhi are arguing about stuff you agree on.

[Hooligan]

Hey, what about me? I'm arguing and agreeing too, but no one seems to take my offer of an alternative seriously. :-(

Hool

[Benedict Stamford]

Don't be a BUTT! VOTE RUMP!

[Miestrâ Schivâ, UrN]

May 29, 2012 20:26:09 GMT -6 Sarac'h Txilvertescu said:

seems like you and Glüc da Dhi are arguing about stuff you agree on.

True, but the ZRT wouldn't exist if we thought the existing opposition parties were doing it all right. Friendly debate among oppositionists is necessary to clarify what the "true alternative" might be and what a non-RUMP government might look like. The key word being "friendly", and sadly I think Glüc really has taken offence at the ZRT trying to justify why we are our own separate party.