Secretary of State issues and Language issues

[islensk]

Hey,
I'm Geof, 17 yo male, from Sydney, Australia.
I found this forum through Langmaker.com
Talossan is listed as one of the Top 10 conlangs.
I'm of Portuguese-Romanian decent, and speak a few European languages. Not all to fluency though.
I'm really interested about Talossan, and would love to learn more about it, and about Talossa in general.
I'm just confused as to what citizenship of Talossa actually is etc.

In reply to this post: Why not have pdf documents available to learn Talossan, and only distribute them to trusted peoples?

My e-mail is [e-mail]
Thanks very much, Geof

[kri]

Azul, Geof, and welcome to Talossa!

Thanks for your interest in the nation and the language we founded, and that we've been building and developing for 25 years. In Talossan English, people whose primary love is the Talossan language are referred to (affectionately!) as "Language Nazis," and we'd love to have more of them.

> I'm just confused as to what citizenship of Talossa actually is etc.

I sent you an e-mail hopefully explaining some of this. I'm sure you know there are a few screwballs out their claiming to be "Talossa" but yes, you're in the right place. The citizenship process is really easy: Tell us why you want to join, get active on Wittenberg, make contact with the Immigration Minister, and he makes the judgement call about granting you citizenship.

If he says yes, then you're a full-fledged Talossan, with voting rights, and so forth; you can be elected to serve in the government and basically do anything you want within law and reason.

Then you have one year to complete a 40-question "Civics Test" (multiple choice) based on the Ár Päts history book. It's a multiple choice, open book test and nobody's ever failed it. :-) If you don't do the test within a year of your naturalization, your citizenship lapses.

> In reply to this post: Why not have pdf documents available to learn Talossan, and only distribute them to trusted peoples?

Sadly, we've learned through bitter experience that some people use Talossa as an arena in which to gain people's trust and then betray that trust. So coming up with a list of who can be trusted and who can't is easier said than done.

Right now, I'm leaning towards just having my copyrighted language materials available in book form. There are pirated copies circulating illegally on the internet in violation of the copyright, of course, but the next edition of the dictionary will feature some 40,000 words (twice the size of the current edition) and will render the current edition completely out of date.

About 2/3 of the new vocabulary is completed already but only exists in a database on my computer (heavily backed up!).

If you're interested, you can help out with creating new vocabulary. Especially with your background in Portuguese and Romanian, that's an excellent sample of the Romance languages Talossan is based on!

Hope to see you back here soon,

Ben

[islensk]

Thanks heaps!

If you want anymore Nordic influence I could help with that too.
Send anything you want to my e-mail address, and I'll have a look.

It's just great to see something like this actually exists in the world, and not just in my mind!

Thanx again, Geof

[Xhorxh Asmour]

Even though you've never asked me to, Ben, I'm ready to help with the development of new vocabulary, too, as I've been a language teacher and translator for 30 years now. I have a database of at least 200 languages, including Albanian, Rumanian, Basque, Italian and Spanish dialects, Slavic languages in general, and a few Asian, African and South American languages. I'm at your disposal, if allowed and necessary.

[Xhorxh Asmour]

Well, I don't completely agree with either of you, Ben and Tomás, but I'm inclined to think that withdrawing the Talossan language from public access will create more and more problems. I myself would like to learn Talossan and have expressed to you, Ben, that I'd love to see an online Talossan conversation course available for anyone willing to learn our language. You're acting as if you were the sole owner of everything Talossan, and you have to recognize that Talossa would be nothing without other people's participation. I'm not afraid to say what I think, even if that means falling into the same position as Tomás. He's probably thinking of leaving Talossa for good, and that would be a terrible loss for all of us.

[Lord Q]

Ben,

If the word bank is going to change so drastically, here is an option:

Let them have the old stuff. Tell them you'd be happy to give it to them under conditions, namely that they cannot call it Talossan or el glheth. Maybe el moct or el traval, but not Talossan or the Talossan word for language. Another condition is that they cannot use any new words that you or CUG come up with. They don't have the language resources you do, so the incidence of both you and them coming up with the same word in the future would be quite minimal. That way, they'll quit whining, there will be no issue as to what is what, and we can get on with language building. They don't want to dialectize Talossan, but they'll have no choice if they want to use it without any fuss. I think they'll do just about anything so you'll leave them alone. So either they take it or leave it, and that's your final offer.

[Lord Q]

Geof, good to have you aboard! I hope you find your stay here pleasant, and get your citizenship stuff in ASAP!

[kri]

> Here is an option:

Interesting idea, but the wider problem is that they continue to use our name, our domain names, and claim that somehow they were in some way responsible for Talossa's language, history, culture, and other things they never spent ten minutes actually building. I wish there were some reasonable people over there with some sort of conscience or morality about stealing other people's property, but hoping for honour among thieves is a lost cause.

Ben

[Lord Q]

Don't skirt the issue. We all know how you feel, and repeating it isn't going to help your cause. In fact, it isn't helping us any either. You can't complain these people into the ground, so change your tactic if you actually want to get anything done.

I implore you to start listening to what others have to say instead of repeating the same tired old rag. This is about ALL of us, not just you.

Interesting idea, but the wider problem is that they continue to use our name,

Considering the language is the most visible aspect of Talossa, my idea would be a step in helping to change that.

our domain names,

I'm sorry you didn't get that taken care of, but the fact is, and any jurisdictional court will agree, that you do not have any claim to those whatsoever.

and claim that somehow they were in some way responsible for Talossa's language, history, culture, and other things they never spent ten minutes actually building.

They didn't? Come to think of it, neither have I. Where does that put me in your heirarchy of citizens, present and former?

I wish there were some reasonable people over there with some sort of conscience or morality about stealing other people's property, but hoping for honour among thieves is a lost cause.

What did you own that they stole?

My point was, if we're getting rid of some stuff, then let whoever wants to use it use it with certain provisions. It forces them to do something they don't want to do, which makes it even more beneficial for us.

I don't now and never will agree that what they did on June 1 was right, and I don't ever want to be a part of it. I want to be a part of THIS. But the fact is, you cannot control them and if you continue to complain and not actually be proactive about it, then I'm through. If that's how it has to be, then I won't let the door hit me in the backside when I exit. You can't annihilate them all at once. If you're to get anything you want from them, you have to do it piece by piece.

My warning is this: if you don't start taking steps to minimize these issues within and without Talossa, they will be a thorn in your side for the rest of your existence, and you'll be welcome to it. Is it worth it?

[islensk]

I just sent an e-mail to [e-mail]

Thanks for the help guys,

Good luck with all the new vocab!
E-Mail me if you need any input
Ciao

[kri]

Geof,

I say again, welcome aboard, and I hope you can look past the occasional snit-fit in Talossa (we are a community of real people, after all, and some of us have tempers!) to see the coolness of what this place has always been about.

Q,

> My point was, if we're getting rid of some stuff, then let whoever wants to use it use it with certain provisions. It forces them to do something they don't want to do, which makes it even more beneficial for us.

If they make us an offer to use some of our stuff without calling it (or themselves) Talossan, then we'll talk. Until then, this just seems like a pie-in-the-sky idea.

As for where you fit in in the hierarchy, you're a Talossan. Talossans are entitled to take credit for their country's accomplishments, and share in them. Ex-Talossans and non-Talossans aren't. Not that complicated.

Ben

[Lord Q]

If they make us an offer to use some of our stuff without calling it (or themselves) Talossan, then we'll talk. Until then, this just seems like a pie-in-the-sky idea.

The problem is, both sides have to be open to it. Considering el glheth is "your baby," you're the one on "our side" that has to be open to it. They'd do damn near anything to get you off their backs.

So I'd say if you're not going to make the first move, then you at least have to listen and stay within the discussion if ANYTHING is to move forward.

[kri]

> They'd do damn near anything to get you off their backs.

Just sell back the domain names at cost, stop using the word "Talossa", and stop using any aspects of Talossan history, language, or culture, and have them go off and be what they actually are -- non-Talossans -- and all will be well.

Ben

[Xhorxh Asmour]

Ben, it's not and will never be that simple, but you can be sure we're not AGAINST you, but FOR Talossa. Your opinion is not the only one that counts, though. I make Q.C.'s words mine.

[Lord Q]

If you're not going to address hardly anything that I've said, it's not worth the time to discuss this with you. But you know that, and that's why you do it.

Like I said, you're welcome to the misery you're bringing upon yourself. This "my way or the highway" stuff is exactly what's causing it. This isn't about just you, it's about ALL of us, but that doesn't matter to you. It's hardly worth having anyone else involved if they don't see eye-to-eye with you.

Add me to the long list of people you've silenced because you found a way to make something not fun.

Bye for now, everyone.