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Post by Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. on Sept 11, 2017 13:02:54 GMT -6
Azul! Citizens of Maricopa, Our dear friend, S:reu Munditenens Tresplet has recently completed two tenures in the Senate representing Maricopa; and it has been learnt that Þon Txoteu É. Davinescu has expressed his desire to contest for the post of Senator of Maricopa. In order to give a healthy fight to the top, I have placed myself in the race as a contending candidate. I am actually a Rumper from my heart down to my rump and elated that the RUMP has officially endorsed my candidature. I seek your good wishes, blessings and obviously 'votes' so that I may win my way as 'your choice' to the Senate  Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. a.k.a. BenArd |
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Post by Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. on Sept 11, 2017 14:14:15 GMT -6
Err...
Can we have some mudslinging?
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Glüc da Dhi
Secretary of State
Posts: 6,112
Talossan Since: 5-14-2009
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Post by Glüc da Dhi on Sept 14, 2017 10:32:37 GMT -6
Not a Maricopan but I do have a question. Are you aware CpI justice cannot be senators? Are you planning to give up your CpI seat if elected?
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Post by Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. on Sept 14, 2017 11:31:43 GMT -6
Am aware of the fact. Let's see what happens. Will think of how to cross the Rubicon, when its absolutely necessary to cross.
However I have always found the law a bit odd and probably needs to be cleansed.
On one hand it is said that the judiciary is supposed to be apolitical, but then again CpI Judges are allowed to be MCs. Further Senators are proposed to be off the ambit of party recommendations, but it is only them who are barred from amongst the politicos from becoming judges.
On a conjoint reading of Section 3 and 1 of Article XVI of the OrgLaw a devious plans comes to mind. Section 3 says "...nor any Senator shall be a Justice of the Cort pü Inalt", but there is no explicit restriction of a Justice from becoming a Senator. Further, according to Section 1, the judges of the Cort pü Inalt shall hold their offices for life (or until resignation), and may be removed by either a two-thirds vote in the Cosâ with approval by the King and the Senäts or due to inactivity as defined by failure to act, rule, or appear in an open case the justice is assigned to or participating in for more than 60 days, as certified by the Ziu in a majority vote. Thus if a Judge is elected a Senator and chooses not to resign, he has to be removed by a 2/3 majority in both houses and that too with the approval of the King.
Maybe my interpretation on both counts might not be liked by many, but ideally lawmakers should make good the ambiguity.
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Glüc da Dhi
Secretary of State
Posts: 6,112
Talossan Since: 5-14-2009
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Post by Glüc da Dhi on Sept 14, 2017 11:46:11 GMT -6
"...nor any Senator shall be a Justice of the Cort pü Inalt", but there is no explicit restriction of a Justice from becoming a Senator. How is the above not an explicit restriction? If person A cannot be person B than person B cannot be person A either. |
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Post by Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. on Sept 14, 2017 12:14:49 GMT -6
Ideally yes. But in reality a lack of perfect choice of words in the OrgLaw.
In my case, when would I be called a Senator? After winning the election? Or before that? Or is it that I can't be declared a winner if I hold on to the seat of the CpI? Will my candidature be cancelled even after the election and at the time of declaration of result since I did not give up the seat in the CpI ?
On the other hand if I am declared a winner, I become a Senator? Or am I just entitled to become a Senator? If its the later, then your logic holds true. However if its the former, then I hold on to the seat of the Senator as well as the CpI. At that juncture I may be removed from any of the places after following the due process of removal if I refuse to resign.
Don't take it otherwise, its purely academic. I guess I won't push it that far.
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Post by Magniloqueu Épiqeu da Lhiun on Sept 15, 2017 9:32:26 GMT -6
I certainly hope that you will not push it that far. It is quite easy: a Senator cannot be (not become) a Justice of the Uppermost Court. You can be either, but not both. In order to become a Senator, you have to resign from your judicial duties.
Regarding your first question: You would be called a Senator as soon as law permits you to practice as a Senator. The cited section of the Organic Law states that a Senator cannot be someone who serves as a CpÎ-Justice, and a CpÎ-Justice cannot be someone who serves as a Senator. This means that, as soon as you receive word of having been elected, you must, without delay, resign from the Uppermost Court. If you do not do so, I reckon that you would be deemed to have forfeited your seat.
Since nobody can evict you from your CpÎ-seat, except if you resign, or if you commit specific grave crimes, you cannot automatically lose your CpÎ-seat at a time when you get elected to the Senäts.
Regarding your second question: Refer to my above-made statement. You cannot be removed from your CpÎ-seat if you refuse to resign; since that would go against judicial independence, and the separation of powers. However, the same separation of powers bars a person from being a CpÎ-justice and a Senator at the same time. Therefore, you would be considered Senator in suspension (or call it Senator in succession, or Senator in waiting, or Senator pending approval, or Senator ab officione) until the elements of law enabling you to become a Senator are fulfilled in their entirety.
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Post by Béneditsch Ardpresteir, O.SPM. on Sept 15, 2017 10:29:12 GMT -6
A well drafted opinion, however the statements as to the vice versa factum in response to the first question is a matter of interpretation.
Maybe what you say is ideal and practical but I guess there never has been any such instances or precedence in the past.
Furthermore, the concept of apolitical judges is a hogwash. There have been instances when the Magistracy was filled with MCs and even ministers ( including yours truly) and now with the merger of the Magistracy with the CpI the same defects of being apolitical can be seen in most of the Judges. Now when one decides to become a Senator, it is only then that the laws come in between to creat hindrances.
To my mind this isn't anything apolitical but simply a political move.
I guess would have to bring in a legislation in the days to come to clear things out.
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Ian Plätschisch
Senator for Maritiimi-Maxhestic
Posts: 4,001 
Talossan Since: 3-21-2015
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Post by Ian Plätschisch on Sept 15, 2017 10:54:31 GMT -6
A well drafted opinion, however the statements as to the vice versa factum in response to the first question is a matter of interpretation. Maybe what you say is ideal and practical but I guess there never has been any such instances or precedence in the past. Furthermore, the concept of apolitical judges is a hogwash. There have been instances when the Magistracy was filled with MCs and even ministers ( including yours truly) and now with the merger of the Magistracy with the CpI the same defects of being apolitical can be seen in most of the Judges. Now when one decides to become a Senator, it is only then that the laws come in between to creat hindrances. To my mind this isn't anything apolitical but simply a political move. I guess would have to bring in a legislation in the days to come to clear things out. Not to beat a dead horse, but there is really nothing to clear up and no room for interpretation. No Senator may also be a Justice of the CpI; if you were to be elected Senator and not resign your CpI seat, you would be a Senator who is also a Justice of the CpI. Inorganic no matter how you slice it. |
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