|
Post by Sir Alexandreu Davinescu on Jun 19, 2015 11:51:19 GMT -6
I didn't see the SoS announce that, huh. I mean, there's a provincial results bit on the election results, and that's what we use... the official provincial results for our province.
|
|
Ian Plätschisch
Senator for Maritiimi-Maxhestic
Posts: 4,001
Talossan Since: 3-21-2015
|
Post by Ian Plätschisch on Jun 19, 2015 21:08:49 GMT -6
I didn't see the SoS announce that, huh. I mean, there's a provincial results bit on the election results, and that's what we use... the official provincial results for our province. So what your saying is; too bad if you didn't specifically write a provincial vote. It doesn't count.
That is a bit ridiculous, given that clearly the provincial leader of the MRPT (me) and the two founders of the TSP (care to join my case, Gaglhen Fortaleça and Daniel Candee?) would have voted for their parties provincially had they known they needed to.
The intention is clear. Ignoring it would be strict legalism for the sake of strict legalism.
|
|
|
Post by Sir Alexandreu Davinescu on Jun 19, 2015 22:48:27 GMT -6
I'm saying, first of all, that we should wait and see, since we definitely can't do anything until the election is certified. If it turns out those three votes are counted in the Chancery's results for us, you might regret trying to put words in my mouth in such an accusatory, hasty, and entirely unnecessary way.
|
|
Ian Plätschisch
Senator for Maritiimi-Maxhestic
Posts: 4,001
Talossan Since: 3-21-2015
|
Post by Ian Plätschisch on Jun 20, 2015 4:19:26 GMT -6
I mean, there's a provincial results bit on the election results, and that's what we use... The provincial results spreadsheet on the election results page does not count the contested votes provincially. Me noticing that is what started this whole issue to begin with. So, unless the chancery changes them before they get to us (which, most likely, they won't), the same results that I saw immediately after the election are the same results we are going to get.
I am bringing this up now so it doesn't look like I am trying to get more votes once the results do come out.
|
|
Ian Plätschisch
Senator for Maritiimi-Maxhestic
Posts: 4,001
Talossan Since: 3-21-2015
|
Post by Ian Plätschisch on Jun 20, 2015 4:25:22 GMT -6
we should wait and see, since we definitely can't do anything until the election is certified. Why I did not "wait and see":
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Though it was a blunt interpretation of your resistance to modifying the chancery results, even if the chancery results are not reflective of intention, I don't believe I was being accusatory or hasty (and a lot of things on Witt are unneccesary, but we still do them )
|
|
|
Post by Sir Alexandreu Davinescu on Jun 20, 2015 7:48:03 GMT -6
Well, frankly, I'm not sure what to do. It doesn't seem legal to do anything until the election is certified, since votes or even the whole election could be thrown out and we can't claim to do anything as an Assembly until the election is officially over. And beyond that, there is no mechanism for overruling the Chancery's official provincial results that I can see. The election law's relevant clause is very short, and cedes everything in the process to the Chancery: "if no one is so chosen, then the Secretary Of State shall conduct the election."
I am open to suggestions, but I'm not interested in fighting about it.
|
|
|
Post by Françal Ian Lux on Jun 20, 2015 12:22:22 GMT -6
The main issue I have here is not that we can't independently certify our own votes, it's the fact that the Commission has yet made an official statement concerning the validity of our government! It's ridiculous!
|
|
|
Post by Sir Alexandreu Davinescu on Jun 20, 2015 13:03:39 GMT -6
Ever since we instituted the secret ballot, this has happened every time. I agree that it is very tedious, but everyone involved is a volunteer and very conscientious, so please cut them some slack. I seem to be alone in thinking that the Commission keeps demonstrating its value... last time there was a delay, but it was over a disputed ballot that would otherwise have been discarded. They've only had like a week to verify every single cast ballot, so maybe let's not start getting upset just yet.
|
|
Ian Plätschisch
Senator for Maritiimi-Maxhestic
Posts: 4,001
Talossan Since: 3-21-2015
|
Post by Ian Plätschisch on Jun 20, 2015 20:28:19 GMT -6
It doesn't seem legal to do anything until the election is certified, since votes or even the whole election could be thrown out and we can't claim to do anything as an Assembly until the election is officially over. No debate there
I give up. I can't convince you to interpret the law in favor of intent. I gave my suggestion, and you keep saying it would be illegal. This is exactly why we should hold our own election.
I would just like to point out that the TSP will be fairly disappointed when they realize the election results spreadsheet does not list them as having received any votes in M-M.
I would sure like to be wrong, and the Chancery give us results that count "party votes" provincially, but this is very unlikely. The chancery is busy enough already.
|
|
|
Post by Sir Alexandreu Davinescu on Jun 20, 2015 20:36:23 GMT -6
You seem to be blaming me... which is weird, because I'm just a Maritiimi-Maxhestic citizen with no authority at all at the moment. As GSU, I'm empowered to keep records, and that's about it, I think. My opinion is no more binding than anyone else's. I'm just giving you my best opinion as a lawyer and legislator on what the legal facts seem to be. It's not like I don't want these three votes to count, after all! You've seen me trying to drag people into activity in the Assembly, year after year, if you've read the past threads. I wish there was no question at all -- really, I wish that the ballots had just been filled out in full, according to the ballot instructions!
If you feel that I am speaking unfairly or using my position as GSU to influence things unjustly, then please say so. I would have not a single tiny bit of problem locking this thread and asking last year's GGS to get things going, instead.
|
|
Ian Plätschisch
Senator for Maritiimi-Maxhestic
Posts: 4,001
Talossan Since: 3-21-2015
|
Post by Ian Plätschisch on Jun 20, 2015 20:49:14 GMT -6
I'm just frustrated. I am trying to convince you, because you are the one of this province's most active citizens, and you actually know how the laws work (and because no one in the chancery seems to care). If this is how the law must be interpreted, then I have done what I can. No blame was ever intended, I'm just as tired of having this discussion as you are.
|
|
|
Post by Sir Alexandreu Davinescu on Jun 21, 2015 10:51:22 GMT -6
MPF is a good guy, and really eager to get things right. He doesn't appear to be aware of the problem - have you asked him specifically?
|
|
Ian Plätschisch
Senator for Maritiimi-Maxhestic
Posts: 4,001
Talossan Since: 3-21-2015
|
Post by Ian Plätschisch on Jun 21, 2015 11:20:28 GMT -6
|
|
|
Post by Sir Alexandreu Davinescu on Jun 27, 2015 16:52:46 GMT -6
Hm, hope we can get this solved.
Another thing we'll need to add to the docket is an election of a new GSU, since I don't think I will be able to continue to serve in that capacity. I am sure one of the many fine citizens of M-M will be able to do it, and look forward to voting on that.
|
|
|
Post by M.T. Patritz da Biondeu on Jun 27, 2015 17:23:07 GMT -6
This is disappointing. We will need some major reforms when we get this assembly going.
|
|