Sir C. M. Siervicül
Posts: 9,636
Talossan Since: 8-13-2005
Knight Since: 7-28-2007
Motto: Nonnisi Deo serviendum
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Post by Sir C. M. Siervicül on Dec 14, 2014 23:33:17 GMT -6
Members of the CÚG and other Ladintschen and umas,
This Llimbaziua, 12 December, began the thirty-fifth year of the history of the Talossan language. That means next Llimbaziua will mark the language's 35th anniversary. I want to take this opportunity to call for cooperative effort of the CÚG and the Büreu del Glheþ of the Ministry of Culture to use this year to plan for the future of the language. In the time before the 35th anniversary of Talossan, I want to challenge us to outline a vision for where we want the language to be by its 40th anniversary. This would include identifying specific goals for the language by its 40th anniversary, and laying out steps to take to achieve them. In short, I propose creating a Plan del Vinveniu per el Glheþ Talossan—a Five-Year Plan for the Talossan Language.
It’s easy to vaguely declare that we want Talossa to “be used more”, etc. I want us to try to establish aims that are objective, tangible, measurable, and/or quantifiable, so that by Llimbaziua 2020 we can meaningfully assess how well we’ve done at achieving them. But at the same time, I want our goals to be ambitious. We need a big vision.
Here are some ideas of my own for goals we could establish, to get the discussion started:
1. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see the national website and TalossaWiki available in Talossan
2. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see a Talossan version of Wikipedia
3. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see a regular Talossan-language periodical being published
4. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see Talossan as the primary language of communication between at least some citizens
Over the next day or two, I will share some of my thoughts on steps to take toward achieving each of these goals.
But what do you think? Where do we want to see the language in five years? How do we get there?
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Tráveç Dun
Citizen of Talossa
Posts: 104
Talossan Since: 12-31-2014
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Post by Tráveç Dun on Dec 15, 2014 10:19:20 GMT -6
I think the idea of a periodical in Talossan is very exciting, and might encourage more people to participate. People love seeing their creative endeavors in print (even if it's PDF-print).
I have wondered, is there any central repository of Talossan works? I see the examples section on talossan.com, but I know there are other works, such as the Lovecraft translations, which are not there. I readily admit this may simply be a gap in my knowledge and such a resource now exists, but if not, I think it should.
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Sir C. M. Siervicül
Posts: 9,636
Talossan Since: 8-13-2005
Knight Since: 7-28-2007
Motto: Nonnisi Deo serviendum
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Post by Sir C. M. Siervicül on Dec 15, 2014 12:41:39 GMT -6
I have wondered, is there any central repository of Talossan works? I see the examples section on talossan.com, but I know there are other works, such as the Lovecraft translations, which are not there. I readily admit this may simply be a gap in my knowledge and such a resource now exists, but if not, I think it should. You can find a mix of English-language and Talossan-language Talossan literature here. The content of talossan.com is a little out-of-date (it's about 2 Arestadas behind the times), but I hope we'll be able to do a complete update within the next few months.
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Sir C. M. Siervicül
Posts: 9,636
Talossan Since: 8-13-2005
Knight Since: 7-28-2007
Motto: Nonnisi Deo serviendum
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Post by Sir C. M. Siervicül on Dec 16, 2014 5:26:32 GMT -6
To follow up on my first post, here are some of my thoughts on steps we could take toward achieving each of the goals I identified in that post: 1. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see the national website and TalossaWiki available in TalossanAn essential prerequisite for this task is developing a larger cadre of translators, which means more and better instructional materials. This basic need for improved and expanded instructional materials and methods is probably relevant to pretty much any goal we might identify. I expect other discussions will follow on various aspects of teaching Talossan. But vocabulary learning is particularly important for translation, and I have already started some projects in that area, so I will discuss that in further detail. Thanks to Lord Hooligan’s resources at talossan.com, the entire Treisour (Talossan-English dictionary) is available online in a conveniently searchable format. But learning vocabulary through a dictionary is extremely inefficient for two reasons. One is that there is no convenient way to focus on the words one most needs to know. In most languages, 2,000-3,000 words account for 90+% of typical texts. If all you have is a 30,000 word dictionary, you’re probably spending 90% learning words that you will rarely if ever encounter or need to use. The other is that, even given a limited set of the most useful words, after a while it is hard to avoid wasting a lot of time reviewing vocabulary that you already know well. The language learner's traditional tool for attacking vocabulary is the time-tested deck of flashcards. But the 21st century has opened up a whole new dimension of possibilities for flashcards in a digital environment. Two developments are key. First, flashcards can be made vastly more effective by use of a spaced repetition system (SRS). An SRS is a system for committing information to long-term memory by implementing an algorithm that times the review of information based on how well you know it. So once you have seen a new word for the first time, an SRS might schedule your second review of the word for the next day, the second review for three days after that, the third review for a week after that, and so on with ever-increasing intervals. The idea is to review new material frequently to make sure it's ingrained and review old material just at the point when you are likely to forget it. SRS maximises efficiency and minimises boredom by keeping you from wasting too much time reviewing words you already know well. Second, there are web sites and programs that will take digital flashcard decks and generate multiple-choice questions, word-match games, etc. from them. This makes learning much more dynamic and interactive than with traditional flashcard review. A couple of the most popular are Quizlet and Memrise. Quizlet lacks SRS functionality but offers some unique games and makes it easy to add images to flashcards. Memrise uses SRS and allows you to convert your flashcard deck into a multilevel course and add "multimedia" levels to provide instruction beyond merely reviewing the flashcards. So, what I have been planning, as a joint project of the Büreu del Glhetg and the CÚG, is to create sets of digital flashcards that will be made available on Memrise and/or Quizlet, and also available for download in the formats of popular standalone SRS programs like Anki and Mnemosyne. One great thing about this technology is that Quizlet and Mnemosyne have iOS and Android apps, and there are many other flashcard apps (e.g. mobile versions of Anki and Mnemosyne) that we will be able to support. So Erteiers will be able to brush up on Talossan whenever they have a few spare minutes, wherever they might happen to be. I hope to have an initial set of basic words, covering maybe 300 items, available by Independence Day with any luck. The next stage will take much longer, and will be an order of magnitude bigger. Possibly as many as 5,000 words, divided into three to five graded levels. Over the past several months I have been compiling a database of words to include in this project, drawing from sources such as a comparative Romance vocabulary site, C. K. Ogden’s Basic English word list, the Voice of America’s (VOA) Special English word list, and conlanger Rick Harrison’s Universal Language Dictionary. By making use of SRS technology and carefully selecting a basic vocabulary of about 5,000 words (prioritised so that the first 1,000 you learn are the 1,000 most essential, and so forth), we can make the task of learning enough vocabulary to be reasonably proficient in Talossan vastly easier for the learner. And by defining an essential word list in this manner, what we would end up with is essentially a “controlled” language, like VOA Special English. This could have all sorts of benefits in other areas. For example, if translators give preference to words on the controlled list when translating documents, they resulting translations will be easier for learners to read. The division of the word list into levels will also make it possible to “grade” texts for reading difficulty and produce graded readers for learners at different levels of proficiency. In order to have a fully glhetgified TalossaWiki, we also need to translate the Mediawiki interface into Talossan. This is the software that provides all the menus and such for the Wiki. The Wikimedia Foundation (which produces the software) has a convenient online translation platform, which should make the job fairly easy for our translators once we have a cadre trained up. 2. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see a Talossan version of WikipediaThe steps toward a glhetgified TalossaWiki identified above (building an expanded cadre of translators and translating the Mediawiki interface) will also make a Talossan version of Wikipedia possible, because Mediawiki is the same software that Wikipedia itself runs on. The two key prerequisites for approval of a Wikipedia project in a new language are an ISO 639-3 code and translated Mediawiki interface. We already have an ISO 639-3 code for Talossan. Once the Mediawiki interface is translated, we can create a test wiki in the Wikimedia Incubator, and once we can show that the test wiki is supported by a reasonable number of editors able to sustain activity over a reasonable period of time, I think we’d have a realistic chance of getting approval for an official Talossan Wikipedia. Of course, the decision to approve a Talossan Wikipedia would be beyond our control. But even if official approval is not forthcoming, we could maintain the functional equivalent indefinitely in the Incubator, or move the project to Wikia as was done with the Klingon and Toki Pona Wikipedias. As far as Wikipedia content goes, the vocabulary-teaching approach I describe under #1 above offers significant benefits in that area. Basic English and VOA Special English are the basis for the Simple English version of Wikipedia. If the Special English and Basic English word lists are covered by our vocabulary-training program, then once a student learns those words they'll know enough to translate basically any of the 118,000 articles in the Simple English Wikipedia without too much difficulty, which would allow us to jump-start a Talossan Wikipedia with maximum efficiency. 3. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see a regular Talossan-language periodical being publishedAgain, expanding the number of people who can read and write in Talossan is essential to accomplishing this goal, both to provide enough manpower to get material written and to provide an audience interested in reading it. Here, also, a vocabulary program that covers the VOA Special English word list could offer additional side-benefits, because VOA offers a vast amount of world news content, much of it free of copyright, that our translator corps should find easy to translate for a Talossan-speaking audience. 4. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see Talossan as the primary language of communication between at least some citizensFor Talossan to become the primary language of communication between some citizens, there must be some citizens for whom Talossan is the strongest language that they have in common. If there is any other language they both speak much better than Talossan, they will naturally gravitate toward relying on that language instead. This means we would have to make learning materials available in languages other than English. For example, if we have French>Talossan learning materials as well as English>Talossan learning materials, then a citizen who speaks French and some Talossan (but little or no English) and a citizen who speaks English and some Talossan (but little or no French) would naturally communicate with each other in Talossan. As mentioned above, one of the inputs for my vocabulary database is a web site with lists of basic Romance vocabulary. This means that once the database is complete, roughly half the words will already have not only English translations, but French, Spanish, and Italian translations as well. And about 40% will have Portuguese translations. So once the English list is done, we will in very short order also be able to produce basic Talossan-French, Talossan-Spanish, Talossan-Italian, and Talossan-Portuguese flashcards and dictionaries. We would just need native speakers of each of these languages to do some error-checking, and the rest would be automatic.
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Post by Cresti da Ion Nouacastra on Dec 16, 2014 8:13:54 GMT -6
To follow up on my first post, here are some of my thoughts on steps we could take toward achieving each of the goals I identified in that post: 1. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see the national website and TalossaWiki available in TalossanAn essential prerequisite for this task is developing a larger cadre of translators, which means more and better instructional materials. This basic need for improved and expanded instructional materials and methods is probably relevant to pretty much any goal we might identify. I expect other discussions will follow on various aspects of teaching Talossan. But vocabulary learning is particularly important for translation, and I have already started some projects in that area, so I will discuss that in further detail. Thanks to Lord Hooligan’s resources at talossan.com, the entire Treisour (Talossan-English dictionary) is available online in a conveniently searchable format. But learning vocabulary through a dictionary is extremely inefficient for two reasons. One is that there is no convenient way to focus on the words one most needs to know. In most languages, 2,000-3,000 words account for 90+% of typical texts. If all you have is a 30,000 word dictionary, you’re probably spending 90% learning words that you will rarely if ever encounter or need to use. The other is that, even given a limited set of the most useful words, after a while it is hard to avoid wasting a lot of time reviewing vocabulary that you already know well. The language learner's traditional tool for attacking vocabulary is the time-tested deck of flashcards. But the 21st century has opened up a whole new dimension of possibilities for flashcards in a digital environment. Two developments are key. First, flashcards can be made vastly more effective by use of a spaced repetition system (SRS). An SRS is a system for committing information to long-term memory by implementing an algorithm that times the review of information based on how well you know it. So once you have seen a new word for the first time, an SRS might schedule your second review of the word for the next day, the second review for three days after that, the third review for a week after that, and so on with ever-increasing intervals. The idea is to review new material frequently to make sure it's ingrained and review old material just at the point when you are likely to forget it. SRS maximises efficiency and minimises boredom by keeping you from wasting too much time reviewing words you already know well. Second, there are web sites and programs that will take digital flashcard decks and generate multiple-choice questions, word-match games, etc. from them. This makes learning much more dynamic and interactive than with traditional flashcard review. A couple of the most popular are Quizlet and Memrise. Quizlet lacks SRS functionality but offers some unique games and makes it easy to add images to flashcards. Memrise uses SRS and allows you to convert your flashcard deck into a multilevel course and add "multimedia" levels to provide instruction beyond merely reviewing the flashcards. So, what I have been planning, as a joint project of the Büreu del Glhetg and the CÚG, is to create sets of digital flashcards that will be made available on Memrise and/or Quizlet, and also available for download in the formats of popular standalone SRS programs like Anki and Mnemosyne. One great thing about this technology is that Quizlet and Mnemosyne have iOS and Android apps, and there are many other flashcard apps (e.g. mobile versions of Anki and Mnemosyne) that we will be able to support. So Erteiers will be able to brush up on Talossan whenever they have a few spare minutes, wherever they might happen to be. I hope to have an initial set of basic words, covering maybe 300 items, available by Independence Day with any luck. The next stage will take much longer, and will be an order of magnitude bigger. Possibly as many as 5,000 words, divided into three to five graded levels. Over the past several months I have been compiling a database of words to include in this project, drawing from sources such as a comparative Romance vocabulary site, C. K. Ogden’s Basic English word list, the Voice of America’s (VOA) Special English word list, and conlanger Rick Harrison’s Universal Language Dictionary. By making use of SRS technology and carefully selecting a basic vocabulary of about 5,000 words (prioritised so that the first 1,000 you learn are the 1,000 most essential, and so forth), we can make the task of learning enough vocabulary to be reasonably proficient in Talossan vastly easier for the learner. And by defining an essential word list in this manner, what we would end up with is essentially a “controlled” language, like VOA Special English. This could have all sorts of benefits in other areas. For example, if translators give preference to words on the controlled list when translating documents, they resulting translations will be easier for learners to read. The division of the word list into levels will also make it possible to “grade” texts for reading difficulty and produce graded readers for learners at different levels of proficiency. In order to have a fully glhetgified TalossaWiki, we also need to translate the Mediawiki interface into Talossan. This is the software that provides all the menus and such for the Wiki. The Wikimedia Foundation (which produces the software) has a convenient online translation platform, which should make the job fairly easy for our translators once we have a cadre trained up. 2. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see a Talossan version of WikipediaThe steps toward a glhetgified TalossaWiki identified above (building an expanded cadre of translators and translating the Mediawiki interface) will also make a Talossan version of Wikipedia possible, because Mediawiki is the same software that Wikipedia itself runs on. The two key prerequisites for approval of a Wikipedia project in a new language are an ISO 639-3 code and translated Mediawiki interface. We already have an ISO 639-3 code for Talossan. Once the Mediawiki interface is translated, we can create a test wiki in the Wikimedia Incubator, and once we can show that the test wiki is supported by a reasonable number of editors able to sustain activity over a reasonable period of time, I think we’d have a realistic chance of getting approval for an official Talossan Wikipedia. Of course, the decision to approve a Talossan Wikipedia would be beyond our control. But even if official approval is not forthcoming, we could maintain the functional equivalent indefinitely in the Incubator, or move the project to Wikia as was done with the Klingon and Toki Pona Wikipedias. As far as Wikipedia content goes, the vocabulary-teaching approach I describe under #1 above offers significant benefits in that area. Basic English and VOA Special English are the basis for the Simple English version of Wikipedia. If the Special English and Basic English word lists are covered by our vocabulary-training program, then once a student learns those words they'll know enough to translate basically any of the 118,000 articles in the Simple English Wikipedia without too much difficulty, which would allow us to jump-start a Talossan Wikipedia with maximum efficiency. 3. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see a regular Talossan-language periodical being publishedAgain, expanding the number of people who can read and write in Talossan is essential to accomplishing this goal, both to provide enough manpower to get material written and to provide an audience interested in reading it. Here, also, a vocabulary program that covers the VOA Special English word list could offer additional side-benefits, because VOA offers a vast amount of world news content, much of it free of copyright, that our translator corps should find easy to translate for a Talossan-speaking audience. 4. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see Talossan as the primary language of communication between at least some citizensFor Talossan to become the primary language of communication between some citizens, there must be some citizens for whom Talossan is the strongest language that they have in common. If there is any other language they both speak much better than Talossan, they will naturally gravitate toward relying on that language instead. This means we would have to make learning materials available in languages other than English. For example, if we have French>Talossan learning materials as well as English>Talossan learning materials, then a citizen who speaks French and some Talossan (but little or no English) and a citizen who speaks English and some Talossan (but little or no French) would naturally communicate with each other in Talossan. As mentioned above, one of the inputs for my vocabulary database is a web site with lists of basic Romance vocabulary. This means that once the database is complete, roughly half the words will already have not only English translations, but French, Spanish, and Italian translations as well. And about 40% will have Portuguese translations. So once the English list is done, we will in very short order also be able to produce basic Talossan-French, Talossan-Spanish, Talossan-Italian, and Talossan-Portuguese flashcards and dictionaries. We would just need native speakers of each of these languages to do some error-checking, and the rest would be automatic. So for #4, are you talking about a language like Esperanto?
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Post by Cresti da Ion Nouacastra on Dec 16, 2014 8:14:36 GMT -6
To follow up on my first post, here are some of my thoughts on steps we could take toward achieving each of the goals I identified in that post: 1. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see the national website and TalossaWiki available in TalossanAn essential prerequisite for this task is developing a larger cadre of translators, which means more and better instructional materials. This basic need for improved and expanded instructional materials and methods is probably relevant to pretty much any goal we might identify. I expect other discussions will follow on various aspects of teaching Talossan. But vocabulary learning is particularly important for translation, and I have already started some projects in that area, so I will discuss that in further detail. Thanks to Lord Hooligan’s resources at talossan.com, the entire Treisour (Talossan-English dictionary) is available online in a conveniently searchable format. But learning vocabulary through a dictionary is extremely inefficient for two reasons. One is that there is no convenient way to focus on the words one most needs to know. In most languages, 2,000-3,000 words account for 90+% of typical texts. If all you have is a 30,000 word dictionary, you’re probably spending 90% learning words that you will rarely if ever encounter or need to use. The other is that, even given a limited set of the most useful words, after a while it is hard to avoid wasting a lot of time reviewing vocabulary that you already know well. The language learner's traditional tool for attacking vocabulary is the time-tested deck of flashcards. But the 21st century has opened up a whole new dimension of possibilities for flashcards in a digital environment. Two developments are key. First, flashcards can be made vastly more effective by use of a spaced repetition system (SRS). An SRS is a system for committing information to long-term memory by implementing an algorithm that times the review of information based on how well you know it. So once you have seen a new word for the first time, an SRS might schedule your second review of the word for the next day, the second review for three days after that, the third review for a week after that, and so on with ever-increasing intervals. The idea is to review new material frequently to make sure it's ingrained and review old material just at the point when you are likely to forget it. SRS maximises efficiency and minimises boredom by keeping you from wasting too much time reviewing words you already know well. Second, there are web sites and programs that will take digital flashcard decks and generate multiple-choice questions, word-match games, etc. from them. This makes learning much more dynamic and interactive than with traditional flashcard review. A couple of the most popular are Quizlet and Memrise. Quizlet lacks SRS functionality but offers some unique games and makes it easy to add images to flashcards. Memrise uses SRS and allows you to convert your flashcard deck into a multilevel course and add "multimedia" levels to provide instruction beyond merely reviewing the flashcards. So, what I have been planning, as a joint project of the Büreu del Glhetg and the CÚG, is to create sets of digital flashcards that will be made available on Memrise and/or Quizlet, and also available for download in the formats of popular standalone SRS programs like Anki and Mnemosyne. One great thing about this technology is that Quizlet and Mnemosyne have iOS and Android apps, and there are many other flashcard apps (e.g. mobile versions of Anki and Mnemosyne) that we will be able to support. So Erteiers will be able to brush up on Talossan whenever they have a few spare minutes, wherever they might happen to be. I hope to have an initial set of basic words, covering maybe 300 items, available by Independence Day with any luck. The next stage will take much longer, and will be an order of magnitude bigger. Possibly as many as 5,000 words, divided into three to five graded levels. Over the past several months I have been compiling a database of words to include in this project, drawing from sources such as a comparative Romance vocabulary site, C. K. Ogden’s Basic English word list, the Voice of America’s (VOA) Special English word list, and conlanger Rick Harrison’s Universal Language Dictionary. By making use of SRS technology and carefully selecting a basic vocabulary of about 5,000 words (prioritised so that the first 1,000 you learn are the 1,000 most essential, and so forth), we can make the task of learning enough vocabulary to be reasonably proficient in Talossan vastly easier for the learner. And by defining an essential word list in this manner, what we would end up with is essentially a “controlled” language, like VOA Special English. This could have all sorts of benefits in other areas. For example, if translators give preference to words on the controlled list when translating documents, they resulting translations will be easier for learners to read. The division of the word list into levels will also make it possible to “grade” texts for reading difficulty and produce graded readers for learners at different levels of proficiency. In order to have a fully glhetgified TalossaWiki, we also need to translate the Mediawiki interface into Talossan. This is the software that provides all the menus and such for the Wiki. The Wikimedia Foundation (which produces the software) has a convenient online translation platform, which should make the job fairly easy for our translators once we have a cadre trained up. 2. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see a Talossan version of WikipediaThe steps toward a glhetgified TalossaWiki identified above (building an expanded cadre of translators and translating the Mediawiki interface) will also make a Talossan version of Wikipedia possible, because Mediawiki is the same software that Wikipedia itself runs on. The two key prerequisites for approval of a Wikipedia project in a new language are an ISO 639-3 code and translated Mediawiki interface. We already have an ISO 639-3 code for Talossan. Once the Mediawiki interface is translated, we can create a test wiki in the Wikimedia Incubator, and once we can show that the test wiki is supported by a reasonable number of editors able to sustain activity over a reasonable period of time, I think we’d have a realistic chance of getting approval for an official Talossan Wikipedia. Of course, the decision to approve a Talossan Wikipedia would be beyond our control. But even if official approval is not forthcoming, we could maintain the functional equivalent indefinitely in the Incubator, or move the project to Wikia as was done with the Klingon and Toki Pona Wikipedias. As far as Wikipedia content goes, the vocabulary-teaching approach I describe under #1 above offers significant benefits in that area. Basic English and VOA Special English are the basis for the Simple English version of Wikipedia. If the Special English and Basic English word lists are covered by our vocabulary-training program, then once a student learns those words they'll know enough to translate basically any of the 118,000 articles in the Simple English Wikipedia without too much difficulty, which would allow us to jump-start a Talossan Wikipedia with maximum efficiency. 3. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see a regular Talossan-language periodical being publishedAgain, expanding the number of people who can read and write in Talossan is essential to accomplishing this goal, both to provide enough manpower to get material written and to provide an audience interested in reading it. Here, also, a vocabulary program that covers the VOA Special English word list could offer additional side-benefits, because VOA offers a vast amount of world news content, much of it free of copyright, that our translator corps should find easy to translate for a Talossan-speaking audience. 4. By Llimbaziua 2020, I want to see Talossan as the primary language of communication between at least some citizensFor Talossan to become the primary language of communication between some citizens, there must be some citizens for whom Talossan is the strongest language that they have in common. If there is any other language they both speak much better than Talossan, they will naturally gravitate toward relying on that language instead. This means we would have to make learning materials available in languages other than English. For example, if we have French>Talossan learning materials as well as English>Talossan learning materials, then a citizen who speaks French and some Talossan (but little or no English) and a citizen who speaks English and some Talossan (but little or no French) would naturally communicate with each other in Talossan. As mentioned above, one of the inputs for my vocabulary database is a web site with lists of basic Romance vocabulary. This means that once the database is complete, roughly half the words will already have not only English translations, but French, Spanish, and Italian translations as well. And about 40% will have Portuguese translations. So once the English list is done, we will in very short order also be able to produce basic Talossan-French, Talossan-Spanish, Talossan-Italian, and Talossan-Portuguese flashcards and dictionaries. We would just need native speakers of each of these languages to do some error-checking, and the rest would be automatic. So for #4, are you talking about a language like Esperanto?
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Tráveç Dun
Citizen of Talossa
Posts: 104
Talossan Since: 12-31-2014
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Post by Tráveç Dun on Dec 16, 2014 9:13:28 GMT -6
The app/flash cards idea is great. Those apps where you can have microbursts of studying whenever you're in line at the dry cleaners are a wonderful way of keeping fresh. I used a similar app to study for the Texas Bar.
As far as getting more people speaking the language, perhaps lessons - or at least a primer - in audio/visual format? Even a pronunciation guide on YouTube would be helpful. I think some folks get as far as the word "Glheþ" or the letters ö and ß and call it a day, and a few simple examples of its use and pronunciation in a pedagogical format could help demystify things for the tyro.
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Sir C. M. Siervicül
Posts: 9,636
Talossan Since: 8-13-2005
Knight Since: 7-28-2007
Motto: Nonnisi Deo serviendum
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Post by Sir C. M. Siervicül on Dec 16, 2014 10:52:01 GMT -6
So for #4, are you talking about a language like Esperanto? Yeah, sort of. Historically, a language used as a means of communication between people not sharing a native language is known as a lingua franca. As far as getting more people speaking the language, perhaps lessons - or at least a primer - in audio/visual format? Yes, people frequently ask for audio or video lessons. I'd love to produce them, but I'm a little concerned about quality. It would take a lot of work and peer review to make sure we're putting out a product that we're comfortable holding out as an example for others to emulate. The fact is, pretty much everyone who currently uses the language has learned from written materials, and has used it almost exclusively for reading and writing. In learning natural languages, one is always advised to look for materials featuring native speakers to avoid picking up a non-native accent. We have no such thing (native speakers) in Talossan.
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Marcel Eðo Pairescu Tafial
Batetz las maes, perf. —— Freelance glheþineir (I only accept Worthless Internet Points™ as payment)
Posts: 448
Talossan Since: May 12, 2014
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Post by Marcel Eðo Pairescu Tafial on Dec 16, 2014 13:14:39 GMT -6
Yes, people frequently ask for audio or video lessons. I'd love to produce them, but I'm a little concerned about quality. It would take a lot of work and peer review to make sure we're putting out a product that we're comfortable holding out as an example for others to emulate. The fact is, pretty much everyone who currently uses the language has learned from written materials, and has used it almost exclusively for reading and writing. In learning natural languages, one is always advised to look for materials featuring native speakers to avoid picking up a non-native accent. We have no such thing (native speakers) in Talossan.I would - again - like to volunteer. My accent is kinda portuguese, I don't know if that's somehow practical.
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Sir C. M. Siervicül
Posts: 9,636
Talossan Since: 8-13-2005
Knight Since: 7-28-2007
Motto: Nonnisi Deo serviendum
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Post by Sir C. M. Siervicül on Dec 17, 2014 17:55:38 GMT -6
I would - again - like to volunteer. My accent is kinda portuguese, I don't know if that's somehow practical. Excellent, thank you. I'll take you up on that. A Portuguese accent is probably one of the closest to a native Talossan accet that exists. Expect a PM within the next few days.
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Post by Roibeardet dal Riesta on Feb 12, 2015 16:24:14 GMT -6
The steps toward a glhetgified TalossaWiki identified above (building an expanded cadre of translators and translating the Mediawiki interface) will also make a Talossan version of Wikipedia possible, because Mediawiki is the same software that Wikipedia itself runs on. The two key prerequisites for approval of a Wikipedia project in a new language are an ISO 639-3 code and translated Mediawiki interface. We already have an ISO 639-3 code for Talossan. Once the Mediawiki interface is translated, we can create a test wiki in the Wikimedia Incubator, and once we can show that the test wiki is supported by a reasonable number of editors able to sustain activity over a reasonable period of time, I think we’d have a realistic chance of getting approval for an official Talossan Wikipedia. A translated MediaWiki interface is required when it is moved, you can at any time start the test wiki already.
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Sir C. M. Siervicül
Posts: 9,636
Talossan Since: 8-13-2005
Knight Since: 7-28-2007
Motto: Nonnisi Deo serviendum
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Post by Sir C. M. Siervicül on Feb 12, 2015 17:51:34 GMT -6
A translated MediaWiki interface is required when it is moved, you can at any time start the test wiki already. True, but since we also need the MediaWiki interface translated to have a fully-Talossan version of TalossaWiki, I figured we'd kill two birds with one stone if we start with that.
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Post by Roibeardet dal Riesta on Feb 13, 2015 11:31:00 GMT -6
A translated MediaWiki interface is required when it is moved, you can at any time start the test wiki already. True, but since we also need the MediaWiki interface translated to have a fully-Talossan version of TalossaWiki, I figured we'd kill two birds with one stone if we start with that. I have just requested the translatewiki.net support to add ár glheþ. Now we just need to wait for them to add it.
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Marcel Eðo Pairescu Tafial
Batetz las maes, perf. —— Freelance glheþineir (I only accept Worthless Internet Points™ as payment)
Posts: 448
Talossan Since: May 12, 2014
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Post by Marcel Eðo Pairescu Tafial on Feb 13, 2015 13:48:29 GMT -6
Just for fun, I translated the Babel info box for Talossan language fluency, basic stuff. Template:User_tzl - Acest uçeir isch ün parleir da natascha del Talossan.
- Éu sint ün parleir da natascha del Talossan.
Template:User_tzl-4 - Acest uçeir parla el Talossan in ün nival quasinatal.
Template:User_tzl-3 - Acest uçeir put comtribuçarh cün ün nival avançat del Talossan.
Template:User_tzl-2 - Acest uçeir put comtribuçarh cün ün nival maxhaneu del Talossan.
- Éu put comtribuçarh cün ün nival maxhaneu del Talossan.
Template:User_tzl-1 - Acest uçeir put comtribuçarh cün ün nival fundamaintschal del Talossan.
- Éu put comtribuçarh cün ün nival fundamaintschal del Talossan.
Template:User_tzl-0 - Acest uçeir non parla el Talossan.
- Éu non parléu el Talossan.
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Post by Roibeardet dal Riesta on Feb 13, 2015 14:24:06 GMT -6
Just for fun, I translated the Babel info box for Talossan language fluency, basic stuff. Template:User_tzl - Acest uçeir isch ün parleir da natascha del Talossan.
- Éu sint ün parleir da natascha del Talossan.
Template:User_tzl-4 - Acest uçeir parla el Talossan in ün nival quasinatal.
Template:User_tzl-3 - Acest uçeir put comtribuçarh cün ün nival avançat del Talossan.
Template:User_tzl-2 - Acest uçeir put comtribuçarh cün ün nival maxhaneu del Talossan.
- Éu put comtribuçarh cün ün nival maxhaneu del Talossan.
Template:User_tzl-1 - Acest uçeir put comtribuçarh cün ün nival fundamaintschal del Talossan.
- Éu put comtribuçarh cün ün nival fundamaintschal del Talossan.
Template:User_tzl-0 - Acest uçeir non parla el Talossan.
- Éu non parléu el Talossan.
Nice, I think we can soon add them. Interested translators can add their username to this list already, just make sure you put them in alphabetically.
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